PE175 Full Floater rear shock rebuild?

[Chuck78]

My buddy has an '84 PE175 that he's been riding and gradually going through everything on the bike to refresh it, and I am looking at buying an 80-84 PE175, specifically talking to a guy about an '83 Full Floater  (unless his nephew talks him out of it first!). 

The 83 I'm in talks about buying was parted out, and seller has been piecing it back together.  He got a shock missing the reservoir, and now has tracked down a reservoir and hose.  May as well look into a total rebuild since it's de-pressurized and missing most of it's oil...

Question - is there a source for any sort of full rebuild kit for these shocks? I'm assuming no, but I figure the shaft bearing, sealhead o-ring, shaft o-ring, wiper seal, and reservoir o-rings are commonly available industrial parts, but the piston bands/rings are the parts I was really concerned about.  Those are much more specific items most certainly. 

If anyone has any links to rebuilds or lists of parts and part numbers, that would be immensely helpful here.  If I get an 80-81, I'm covered as I have heeps of vintage Fox Factory Shox and Fox Gas Shox, but never played much with any monoshocks other than riding my KDX220...

I'm dreaming, but hopefully I someday could track down a Fox Twin Clicker in the proper size for a Full Floater PE175...

[ESR80PE]

Race Tech has seal heads for them. Biggest issue will be if the alloy body is worn out. If its not, then getting is hard anodized is a must for longer life and prevent it getting even more worn out. i could make  White Power Super adjuster for one of these but it is a long process to collect the parts and piece it all together but would be way easier than a Fox twin clicker as i have 81-95 RM125-500 WP specs to work with. Another option is  a custom built Ohlins. Worx Performance makes brand new shock for 82-84 PE175's too. I really would not bother with stock KYB shock to be honest u less you are gonna make a steel body fit Race Tech gold valve etc etc. Too many design flaws with alloy bodies. Hard Anodizing is still only a bandaid solution for a poor choice made by KYB.

[Chuck78]

All great info to know, Leith!
It sounds like a Full Floater PE is quite an investment due to the alloy main cylinder... Perhaps some DIY home anodizing would be in order there? The piston band was also a big concern for me, as they're fairly size specific... Sealhead parts can all be sourced easily, as with valving components.

Are there no tricks to swap on a steel main cylinder from other KYB monoshocks?


FYI Works Performance went out of business when the owner/founder, Gil Vaillancort, passed away around a year or so ago.

Oh I see! Actually his daughter reopened it as Works Shocks / Worx Shocks!

Racetech can certainly build one of their shocks to fit, & would also likely be able to fully rebuild and anodize the stock shock body. I will avoid anything WP due to the questionable name/nickname, although they make fine products and come as OEM on many modern KTM's. They're not as common in North America either.
I'll look into my options here. This does make me think more of a twin shock 80-81 (since I have so many Fox twin shocks here on the shelves), but I'm nearly ready to close a deal on this 83 PE175 here, & I know it'll be the more capable choice.

As always, Thank you so much for your insights.

[Chuck78]

Interesting... Racetech doesnt list the PE's, but I looked up a similar RM125, & they comment on the need for Anodizing:
Shock Comments
Hard Anodizing the Shock Body recommended. Spring adapter collar required. Spring Collar goes on top. Use Yam petcock 2K5-24500-00-00 as float bowl runs dry of fuel. Threaded body cap.
I was hoping to find any sort of pricing guide on Full Floater PE's & RM's at Worx or Racetech, but it looks as if I'll have to inquire on Monday.
I'll check and see if FullFloater.com is still around and dig around there for any classifieds or other info as well.

[drumnagorrach]

I found a bit of an issue with all the none standard bearings on the floater rear end ,even the shock bearings are none standard and expensive from Suzuki .I reamed out the bell crank to standard 18 mm spherical bearings and machined the top hardened spindle down to fit needle roller bearing inner sleeves .

[Chuck78]

Nov 30, 2019 15:24:27 GMT drumnagorrach said:

I found a bit of an issue with all the none standard bearings on the floater rear end ,even the shock bearings are none standard and expensive from Suzuki .I reamed out the bell crank to standard 18 mm spherical bearings and machined the top hardened spindle down to fit needle roller bearing inner sleeves .

Good info to know, so none of the pieces are standard bearing/bushing sizes at all? You have to buy all of these Suzuki full floater linkage "wear-parts" OEM?

[Chuck78]

Nov 30, 2019 0:16:45 GMT ESR80PE said:

Race Tech has seal heads for them. Biggest issue will be if the alloy body is worn out. If its not, then getting is hard anodized is a must for longer life and prevent it getting even more worn out.

Another option is  a custom built Ohlins.

Worx Performance makes brand new shock for 82-84 PE175's too.

I really would not bother with stock KYB shock to be honest uless you are gonna make a steel body fit RaceTech gold valve etc etc. Too many design flaws with alloy bodies. Hard Anodizing is still only a bandaid solution for a poor choice made by KYB.

Any idea how much an Ohlins or Worx Shocks rear shock costs these days?

With the options that I selected from Racetech, I was looking at $1,099 for fully adjustable damping...
I like Racetech because they fully support a wide range of vintage bikes (street & dirt) including the forks, and they even advertise crank rebuild and cylinder porting for two strokes.
I never cared for the fancy modern look of the Racetech shocks though, but the remote reservoir monoshocks seem to be different



& also, for the prices of these aftermarket shocks, I might just buy a used shock body as a spare, as you can readily buy brand new remote reservoir and hoses, and seal heads all over the Internet for these...




And FYI I noted that it is no longer called Works Performance, & not Worx Performance, but rather, Worx Shocks...

[Chuck78]

So it is seeming to be that while a Full Floater PE175 may be at the top of the heap for a 1982 & earlier 2T vintage enduro bike, the upkeep to maintain that handling & ride quality status is quite expensive!
So IF your rear shock aluminum main cylinder body bore is not ruined, & IF the shaft is straight,not rust pitted, & not scored, you can get away with hard anodizing the shock, putting in a new sealhead assembly, & buying a new reservoir o-ring seal and piston band (I presume they sell them at Racetech, parts descriptions are not very specific for the RM125 Full Floater Shock (PE is not listed on their website). Not sure if they list a 40mm shock valving piston band or not, but they list a Gold Valve assembly which will come with it's piston band, for $179.99.

Replacement shafts are only sold WITH the Gold Valve assembly attached, & for $499.99! That's $320 for a shaft...
At that point, you're better just going with the base option brand new model-specific shocks from Worx or Racetech. Unless you are a purist going for all original!

Add to this the cost of all 16 or so pivot point bushings/bearings and related seals & other parts...$$$$ wow it adds up!

I'm going to try and go the budget rebuild and anodizing route for now, with the intent of getting a Worx or Racetech new shock or vintage Fox Twin Clicker in the future. If I ever were to sell the bike, selling it WITH an $800-1100 aftermarket shock would certainly NEVER recuperate half the cost of the shock and other upgrades, so having a fresh good known updated stocker would be essential.

But the counter-argument would be that you're going to be spending money on the same area of the bike twice that route... But able to resell either separately.

There are KYB 40mm piston bands and expander o-rings on eBay, but who knows if they are the correct thickness and height for our Full Floater shocks... They are for 2000's Husqvarna applications for smaller displacement bikes!

[ESR80PE]

works.pdf (740.4 KB)I would not try to DIY anodize. the type they do the bodies in is harder than standard decorative anodizing. Bit like show chrome on exhausts vs hard chrome on forks. Drew Smith can rebuild the stock shocks and get them hard anodized but you know my feelings on the alloy body shocks by now.

Worx shock listing attached. be aware that Worx was doing some alloy and some steel body shocks. I have no idea what ones have what right now.

Should work if you right click and and choose 'save as'

Fox twin clickers are very hard to find. To make one for a PE i bet you would need to find 3 or 4 off various bikes (i have only seen them for 80's street bikes on ebay) and cannibalize them to make shock dimensionaly correct, might evn require a custom made shaft etc and then hope you have got the right shims required to get damping right, if not then pray they are not odd/special. I know a guy who is getting  a batch of Fox factory twinshock shims made because they are odd imperial sizes.

I would not worry too much about internal wear parts of KYB shock. Even if no wear ban is available, someone can machine one up. I have had them made for Simons damper rods and older Fox Gas shocks out of a PTFE type material. Also many bearing/seal places sell rolls of piston band material in various grades and dimensions. I have had to go through all this for restoring old Luft and White Power twinshocks where no parts are available anymore.

I cant remember which bearings it is but theres some one the full floater that can be replaced with off the shelf heim bearings same as the twinshock 80/81 bearings  in at least one area,  if you make a reducing sleeve or ream out the linkage/strut/rocker arm or what ever part it is. 175 owners will know. The twinshock 80/81 bearings can be used in at least one area.

[drumnagorrach]

I replaced the needle roller bearings in the bell crank with NK 18/20 INA needle roller bearings (18x26x20), I reamed the casting out to suit . This meant that the hardened spindle was too small ,so I machined it down to 15 mm o/d to suit LR 15x18x12.5ina inner bearing ring , two each side .

I used GE10FW 10 mm spherical plain bearings in the shock eyes ,they're not perfect in that the outer surface area is not as wide as the original and may indent into the alloy shock eyes , if it does ,I will open out the eyes and fit steel sleeves .

For the bell crank to vertical link bearings I used GXSW-M08 Steel/PTFE -Dunlop bearings , this requires the crank ends to be reamed out by .5 mm I think ,can't remember exactly .

My bearings weren't worn out just rusted with neglect , you may be lucky in a dry country and not suffer from the rampant rust experienced in UK .


Quite a lot of special rubberised washers covering all bearings , I re.used what I could and  improvised with stainless washers and O rings where I couldn't .

[Chuck78]

Great ingenuity, I must applaud your work there. I read a bit on this from your build thread.

Thanks so much for the info. It's just wild that Suzuki would fill the rear end of thesemachines with so many non-standard sizes.

[rocmoc]

Better late than never as I came on here last winter looking for help(did not post). I have owned my 1982 PE175 since it was new. I purchased it in May of that year and raced it for 10 years in National Enduros and a couple of MX races. Had the same problem as the OP since last year as both my rear shock and fork seals failed. Rebuilt twice and would not hold. Racetech gave me a price of approx $1500 plus shipping as they said it sound like they needed to be anodized. So I started a long search of a different fix, maybe something with clickers. Finally rode my PE yesterday. Rear shock from 1986 KDX200 (the only year with clickers) and DR350 triple clamp and forks with clickers. A few minor mods req'd. Change out DR350 triple clamp stem shaft (bearings are the same) and use PE175 stem. Minor spreading of the bottom mount on the swing arm for the rear shock (be gentle) and grinding on the top link (mine had a lot of meat and steel so was not worried)to make enough room for the shock to fit. Everything else is easy. EXCEPT I wanted to keep my front drum brake. I made a bracket with a block of metal to anchor in the slot for the drum and use caliper mounts. Use the DR350 axle bolt (don't need the spacer as the PE spacer fits perfect). A few routing issues for cables but looks like a Stock PE, but the forks and rear shock are adjustable. Got everything on Ebay and I lucked out with forks (paid a little more) and rear shock that work for now and did not need to be resealed. Spent just under $400. Rode once and needed to do tuning of the forks which I did this morning. (may have to fine tune more) Riding Sat on first longish ride.

rocmoc n So. AZ

[rocmoc]

The ride was the best in 6 years. PE was great. Just had to fine tune. Put a 1/2 turn of pre-load back into the front forks, I weigh less than 150lbs in full riding gear. When I installed the forks I lowered the height 1/2 inch thus making the bike twitchy in the sand and at higher speeds (notice the seat in the pic, cut it down in '82). Adjusted the forks, raising the front end to where the top of the fork tubes are flush with the top of the top triple clamp. Amazing the effect of doing those two adjustments. Test rode, cleaned her and put her away. The dust is HORRIBLE this year as we have only had 1 1/2" of rain this monsoon season, should be 13". I forgot to add the original forks are 38mm and the new (from DR350) are 43mm. She actually is much better than new. I was hitting ruts and rocks that would have jarred my teeth out but did not. Very, very pleased and saved a $1000 if I had sent them to Gold Valve. I'm not bashing Gold Valve, I didn't want to spend that kind of money and not have clicker adjustments.

rocmoc n AZ

[Admin]

So I started a long search of a different fix, maybe something with clickers. Finally rode my PE yesterday. Rear shock from 1986 KDX200 (the only year with clickers) and DR350 triple clamp and forks with clickers. A few minor mods req'd. Change out DR350 triple clamp stem shaft (bearings are the same) and use PE175 stem. Minor spreading of the bottom mount on the swing arm for the rear shock (be gentle) and grinding on the top link (mine had a lot of meat and steel so was not worried)to make enough room for the shock to fit.

Hi. Nice report.
It would be interesting I think if you can post pictures and more details of your modifications under the "Technical Discussion" -> "Modifications Upgrades and Improvements" area.
When/if you have time.
I think the rear shock mod would be of interest to others needing a replacement.

Thank you.

chuck b

[rocmoc]

Will do! Have it up by the end of this coming weekend.

rocmoc n AZ